SURMOUNT: what the trials say vs what this community says
SURMOUNT: what the trials say vs what this community says. Change my mind, genuinely — I have no stake in being right about this.
Research-use-only material is not approved for human use. Anything in this thread about how a research vial "should" titrate is a discussion about chemistry, not a plan.
SURMOUNT-1 ran 72 weeks with the top arm around 21% mean body weight change. SURPASS is the diabetes programme and reports glycaemic endpoints, so quoting the two interchangeably is a category error.
The four-week interval in the label is a minimum. Nothing about the pharmacology requires you to step on schedule, and the trials stepped on a calendar because trials have to.
I will update this if the picture changes rather than quietly leaving it up.
best — the order this archive was captured in
Weekly dosing again, half-life in the same neighbourhood as sema, so a step change takes about a month to reach steady state. Judging a new step at day five is judging noise.
Appetite effect for me is flat across seven days. On sema it was a wave. Same person, different molecule.
That percentage is body weight change, not body fat. Different measurement, and the distinction gets lost every time.
Are you comparing yourself with the trial mean or with the people who post the most?
if 7.5 is working, 10 is not automatically better
Are you comparing yourself with the trial mean or with the people who post the most?
Saving this one. It is the clearest statement of the stall problem I have read here.
Same experience with the appetite effect being flatter across the week rather than front-loaded.
Disagree with the conversion table. There is no validated equivalence between the two molecules and posting one as though there is does real damage.
Small fix: SURMOUNT is the obesity programme, SURPASS is the type-2 programme. They are different endpoints and the numbers do not transfer.
Small fix: SURMOUNT is the obesity programme, SURPASS is the type-2 programme.
gustav_vermeulen is right that the two molecules are not interchangeable. There is no published conversion and the ones circulating are invented.
a lot of people plateau nicely at 10mg and never need 15
stepping every four weeks is a ceiling on speed, not a schedule you must hit
Which week did the appetite change actually land for you?
Does constipation follow the day after the shot, or is it spread across the week?
Left up, flair changed to Discussion. It is an opinion post and that is fine as long as it is labelled.
What step are you on and how long have you been there?
switching from sema is not a dose conversion, there is no clean equivalence
I would separate the two claims. That the GIP arm exists is uncontroversial; that it explains your muscle cramps pattern is a guess.
Vials and pens carry the same molecule; what differs is fill volume, device tolerance and whether you are doing your own arithmetic. Neither is inherently more accurate.
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It is a dual GIP and GLP-1 receptor agonist, and the GIP arm is the part that has no equivalent in the semaglutide threads. That is why the side-effect profile reads differently rather than just milder.
This matches mine. Milder constipation than I expected, and what there was settled inside a fortnight of each step.
Sulphur burps for the first eight days after each step, then nothing. Predictable enough that I planned my week around it.
Right. And the sema-to-tirz "conversion" people post is invented. There is no published equivalence.
Right.
Not sure about this bit. The GIP arm being real does not tell you that it is what caused your particular week.
- 1Weekly dosing again, half-life in the same neighbourhood as sema, so a step…7 comments in this branch · started by u/two_mil_or_one
- 2Disagree with the conversion table. There is no validated equivalence…7 comments in this branch · started by u/mikkel_ogunleye